Brexit Benefits

[piman2k]

This is the best example yet of Brexit is not about facts but beliefs, relating to that CPTPP deal.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...fic-trade-deal

The department for trade, staffed by civil servants and economists, has generated figures of 0.08% growth over a decade.

Kemi Badenoch has openly and publicly criticised the DFT, the people who work for her, effectively because this is not a great figure to tout on the morning media rounds.

Remember, say what the government want you to say or don't speak at all is the new modus operandi. That's cosplay fascism.

Edit - one for DLowe, it's also important to note that the CPTPP allows private companies to sue the government if they believe that government actions have adversely affected their profits.

[piman2k]

The clearest indication yet that the cost of operating the border for food goods will be paid for by the food industry and (ultimately) consumers.

https://www.thegrocer.co.uk/brexit/f...678003.article

The new Border Target Operating Model builds on the previous proposals agreed as part of the Brexit trade deal.

Under the plans, any products such as meat or dairy eligible for physical inspections will be forced to pay between £20-£43 per consignment to help the government “recover operating costs which are necessary to undertake physical inspections at BCPs [border control posts.

Especially interesting is this line:

“The charge would apply to all eligible consignments, whether or not they are selected for a BCP inspection,” says the document.

Which I think it's easy to read as you'll pay regardless of if you're inspected or not.

As you can expect, the food industry hasn't responded well:

The plans have alarmed importers who now face huge new costs to help fund government spending.

“It is a massive additional cost if you aggregate,” said Shane Brennan, CEO of the Cold Chain Federation. “We’re talking about millions to pay the government to fund its infrastructure and the people sitting in those booths.”

And what does that ultimately suggest? Well, food companies aren't going to just soak that up so expect food prices to rise again, I would argue by more than the EU. And of course that's only applicable to the importers that can make it work, once again I expect we will see a further reduction in small traders importing into the UK.

Edit to add - the BBC has also picked up the story with a further comment from Shane Brennan.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65199705

"Imagine you're a UK and EU food exporter of Parma ham or buffalo mozzarella. As of October you need to know more complex rules, find a local vet, pay them between €200-700 to fill in complex forms, find a specialist haulier, pay a customs agent and pay UK inspection charges of up to £42.

"A significant number of those types of exporters will choose not to do it," he said.

Mr Brennan said if the draft proposals went through as planned there would be a "painful realignment with significant short-term disruption" for the UK.

"Nothing in these plans is going to stop that from happening. We will get food from around the world but it will be more expensive, there will be less choice, it will be slower and more complicated to do."

I'm tired of all this Brexit winning.

[piman2k]

"UK to be one of worst performing economies this year, predicts IMF"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65240749

"IMF researchers have previously pointed to Britain's exposure to high gas prices, rising interest rates and a sluggish trade performance as reasons for its weak economic performance."

Worst in the G7. 19th out of 20 in the G20, the 20th being Russia.

[piman2k]

A 200 year old lace maker in Derbyshire is considering going under after being hit with an HMRC retrospective bill.

They export their lace to a place in France who are the only place that can dye and process it, before it's sent back to them in Derby to be used.

But under the new rules, because it doesn't undergo "sufficient transformation" it is not exempt from import duties when it's sent back in.

Thus they have been hit with an 8% tax on goods they already own, back dated 2 years. Why back dated? Because HMRC were still deciding what the rules were.

They have already had to lay off 6 of their 10 staff.

Welcome to post Brexit right wing "free trade".

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...wedding-dress/

[R3K1355]

So does this mean items from 6Boost and (that other Ozzy company that does loads of S-body bits who's name I've forgot) can now be imported without any tax or duty?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-65390109

[piman2k]

I have been hunting for answers for that since it was announced. But at best, if it does affect us, it will be duty only. VAT will almost certainly still be charged.

[piman2k]

Well well well, what a surprise

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65612295

Vauxhall-maker warns Brexit may force it to close UK factory

One of the world's biggest carmakers has warned it may have to close UK factories if the government does not renegotiate the Brexit deal.

Stellantis warned that if the cost of electric vehicle manufacturing in the UK "becomes uncompetitive and unsustainable, operations will close".

From next year, 45% of the value of an electric car should originate in the UK or EU to qualify for trade without tariffs. This will rise to 65% in 2027.

Stellantis said it was "now unable to meet these rules of origin" due to the recent surge in raw material and energy costs.

Why you say? Well that's easy, because the UK entered into an agreement that no manufacturer could reasonably maintain, without consulting the industry.

Then today, JLR added it's voice as well as Ford:

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-shut-uk-plant

BritishVolt, seen as the only real way of doing this, is bankrupt because the Government wouldn't help it out when it needed it (granted, it was ambitious but the Government has no vision or strategy.

And now finally, with less than 6 months to go, Sunak has finally started talking to the EU about it:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65631167

Ludicrous.

[docwra]

The electric car thing is a bit scary (even more scary than Brexit itself) as it shows the government not only fail to take advice from experts, they dont understand the deals they are making. See also REACH for chemical regulations and even repealing EU laws that they U turned on this week.

More positively Farage has admitted its "failed" and UK has "not actually benefited from Brexit economically"
Well theres a surprise. How long before the rest of them have to admit its a fcuk up too and we can start fixing stuff?

[R3K1355]

https://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/p/lets...-on-billboards

Nigel Farage has finally admitted “Brexit has failed”.

It’s a colossal admission from the godfather of the Brexit campaign and should be the final verdict on the catastrophic experiment.

But the right-wing press who helped deliver our exit from the European Union will do their best to hide and spin Farage’s moment of honesty on BBC’s Newsnight.

That’s why it’s down to all of us to get his message out there, as a new 3-word Brexit slogan on giant billboards up and down the country.

We’ve spoken to suppliers who say that if we book in bulk we can get a billboard site for about £500. So if we raise £10,000 that’s 20 sites, £50,000 that’s 100 locations to be seen by countless people. Every penny raised will go for paying for the posters.

Brexit Has Failed. The argument’s over now. Let’s get the word out across the country.

[piman2k]

The electric car thing is a bit scary (even more scary than Brexit itself) as it shows the government not only fail to take advice from experts, they dont understand the deals they are making. See also REACH for chemical regulations and even repealing EU laws that they U turned on this week.

I can't lie, as a design engineer in EV batteries, it is becoming another source of stress and drama for me and my colleagues.

Tbh, I am tired of having spent the last 7 years fretting about the security of my industry and my job, especially since had Brexit not happened, my industry has demonstrably shown it wouldn't be facing any of this uncertainty.

This is why I dislike Brexit voters, regardless of if they were fooled or made a conscious, informed decision.

They have achieved nothing but make a vast number of people's lives more difficult and make almost everyone objectively poorer by measure of GDP.

[piman2k]

And only a day after Sunak confirmed he's going to do something, Kemi Badenoch has gone back to her alternate reality:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b2341446.html

Business secretary Kemi Badenoch has claimed the automotive sector’s fears it cannot make electric vehicles in the UK “isn’t to do with Brexit”.

This isn’t to do with Brexit – this is to do with supply chain issues following the pandemic and the war in Russia and Ukraine.”

Honestly, I despair. It's always the same, blame something else other than exactly what it is.

[DLowe]

Might be a good thing in the long term for the car industry to fall on its arse....

Electric cars will not work on our current infrastructure and there are no plans to improve it to the point its viable, whatever you are told on the news it will not happen.

Hopefully it will lead to a reconfigure of the countries transport system.

I love having a car, but the way the roads and dick heads using them are going I can't say I'd miss it all that much and as for the environment they do absolutely nowt to improve it, just move the harm to another location/industry.

If handled right it could be an opportunity to improve........ I certainly don't think it will be tho

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[piman2k]

Might be a good thing in the long term for the car industry to fall on its arse....

Honest question, are you trolling? Have you rehearsed how to be a d1ckhead? Because I know you keep making a point about how the world outside your town doesn't really matter, and this is just reinforcing that.

800,000 direct and indirect workers in the car industry would probably disagree with you about it being a good thing that it falls flat on it's arse. You know, with it being a multi, multi billion quid industry and cars being literally our most valuable export.

This is only one page, but it should sum it up. Granted it's got more than 10 words and no soundbites so you'll struggle, but the pictures will do the talking for you:

https://www.smmt.co.uk/reports/uk-au...20for%20export.

Electric cars will not work on our current infrastructure and there are no plans to improve it to the point its viable, whatever you are told on the news it will not happen.

So apart from the fact that the ENTIRE UK car industry disagrees with you, to the point where it is investing literally billions of its own money, why don't we have a look at what NATIONAL GRID say:

https://www.nation***rid.com/stories...misconceptions

Does the electricity grid have enough capacity for charging EVs?

The most demand for electricity in recent years in the UK was for 62GW in 2002. Since then, the nation’s peak demand has fallen by roughly 16% due to improvements in energy efficiency.

Even if we all switched to EVs overnight, we believe demand would only increase by around 10%. So we’d still be using less power as a nation than we did in 2002 and this is well within the range of manageable load fluctuation.

And

In the UK, National Grid has proposed the optimum locations for adequate grid capacity to enable others to provide ultra-fast chargers, ensuring that nobody on the strategic road network (motorways and principle dual carriageways) is further than 50 driven miles from ultra-rapid charging. This will give drivers consistency, continuity and therefore confidence that their main – or only – car can be electric

There are 45,000 public chargers nationwide at 25,000 locations. This doesn't include private chargers at home.

By comparison, there are only 8,300 petrol stations.

This is JUST the chargers in your area.



But sure, stick to what you're saying, you know, you do you boo.

[DLowe]

National grid will say whatever the government needs them to say...... the actual network which connects houses together is failing before cars are connected mainly due to lack of investment since privatisation and the 10% increased demand is a good spin on it... the harmonics and cyclic loading from the dc converters cause the biggest problems, usually the breaking down of the laminations and varnish in the already ancient 60s and 70s transformers which are prolific through the country.

Do you honestly not believe the car industry is now ridiculous, with the cheapest reasonable electric car choice costing double the average wage. Streets full of cars all doing the same journeys to the same industrial parks every day. The general relienence of so.ethkng that is so environmentally damaging lots of lip service to improve but no alternatives offered.

The only public transport that's viable for everyday use been in London.

It is a huge industry but one that has been grown beyond reasonable levels and for the future probably should not be relied upon as the savoiur of Britain.

It's been pumped up to unsustainable levels as its been an easy tax target for years as outside of any massive city they have been made a necessity not an option for people to just get kn with living and are becoming so unaffordable but still can't be got rid off in an extreme cost of living crisis.

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[piman2k]

Oh fcuk me you are so full of shit I've got second hand embarrassment for you.

It is a huge industry but one that has been grown beyond reasonable levels and for the future probably should not be relied upon as the savoiur of Britain.

It's been pumped up to unsustainable levels as its been an easy tax target for years

Who says it's grown beyond a reasonable level?

What is a reasonable level for the car industry?

Who says it's been pumped up to unsustainable levels?

What does pumped up to unsustainable levels mean?

Do you not think if it is a high contributor of tax to the Govt that it's a bad thing that it would fail?

Yet again, more blind conjecture and spurious comments about National issues from someone who confesses to barely ever leaving his home town.

[piman2k]

Do you honestly not believe the car industry is now ridiculous, with the cheapest reasonable electric car choice costing double the average wage

The UK average salary is somewhere between 25k and 28k.

The Citroen AMI is £8.5k. The Smart ForTwo is 22k. There are dozens of EV's at the £30k mark.

If you need a hand with maths, 2 x 25 does not equal 30.

[DLowe]

Tax tax tax..... exactly that, its a cash cow industry....

Think for yourself is it a sustainable industry to have a product that is so much more expensive than that the wage you need it to earn, especially when you factor in all the other expensiese it's impossible to sustain.

We are now at the point where the only reasonable way most people can afford a new electric vehicle is to rent it, for an extortionate amount each month, meaning you will no longer own a car.

That car goes back in the system after 4 yrs to be rented again by poorer families to rent but with a reduced battery life.

What happens then? It gets scrapped as no one can afford to buy it and replace the battery.

The battery is made up of metals which are already as rare or more rare than the oil we make petrol from and that's not to mention the horrific working conditions for the people mining them.

If the world was bothered then public transport would be developed and pushed, not cars but its not about the environment

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[DLowe]

Volvo, polestar, tesla, bmw I, Etton etc are all well in excess of 2x the average wage....

But these are also the ones people can sort of afford by renting not purchasing.

It's not a sustainable buisness model.

Where do you live when you buy your new citroen ami cause I sure as he'll don't have enough change get a new one every 4 yrs.

And that's before you fact in how worthless they are when they age due to battery degradation. A low mileage petrol is just as good at 10yrs as a new one, battery's depreciate whether used or not, in some cases worse if not used

That said, is ant new car petrol diesel or battery actually affordable anymore?

The costs have gone so mental is it actual a possibility to walk into a show room and buy a car monthly without an unaffordable payment at the end?

Remember when you could go buy a fiesta for 60x monthly payments a normal job would allow you to pay for alongside rent and a holiday/food?

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[DLowe]

The UK average salary is somewhere between 25k and 28k.

Not round here..... closer to 20k, my Mrs has 10yrs NHS experience with disabled children, 5yrs in schools as a family support liaison and can not get any more than 18k anywhere

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[piman2k]

Volvo, polestar, tesla, bmw I, Etton etc are all well in excess of 2x the average wage....

So what? Ferraris are 20 times the average wage.

You said:

the cheapest reasonable electric car choice costing double the average wage

which is bollocks.

Regarding this:

how worthless they are when they age due to battery degradation

By what measure have you deemed used EVs worthless?

Average BEV degradation for normal use case is around 2% per year. So a 400 mile range car in 4 years will do 368 miles on full charge. Hardly renders a car worthless.

Worth pointing out you're not answering any of the questions I've raised about things you've already said, you're just spewing bollocks.

Are you done just talking shit now?