All right, I know this sounds a lot, but it's doable.
So, what mechanical problems I should anticipate going from current ~400HP to 600+ ? Going to put forged rods, and probably gearbox won't hold at all, but what else?
Discussion with arguments is welcome!
Wasn't it Shogun on here that had stupid amounts of power from a CA? Should ask him
Be prepared for massive lag though...
And Tony, he had 600bhp, not sure if it was FW or RWHP but it was big. Not sure why you'd want 600 though, it's an odd target.
Norris designs had a 600hp one i think
What are your current specs thats the main question.
You'd want a forged crank for that power level. Obviously rods and pistons. Mhg, head work from port and polish to valves and cams springs and retainers.
Gearbox you'll need a vg30 conversion, a twin plate os giken clutch at minimum, a skyline diff and shafts as the s body items will die quickly. Ecu with map sensor as z32 would be maxed out at 500.
Big decent flowing intercooler, decent cooling mods obviously, you'll want a custom intake manifold as although the standard items may flow enough, it runs lean on number 4 and is pretty restrictive.
My build spec will handle 550 easily, but I'm going for 450 as after that it's lag city.
You'll also want some heavy chassis bracing as the Oem chassis will twist putting that much power to the ground, so braces front and rear upper and lower and a cage at minimum
Mobne's made 705 whp on stock crank, 260 degree 8.8mm lift tomei pro cams,was on boost at 5k ish and some other parts were stock as well like diff and shafts at that power level,his more recent engine is 575>600 ish, Sure I read on here via zilvia a chap in japan found stock crank limit was 845 bhp
I wont post the vids but mobne's car at gatebil is cool to watch
The standard diff setup will take it, but I can't imagine for long, since apex went through the trouble of desiring new shafts for 600 bhp as theirs kept snapping. Mine should be on full boost around 3-3.5 k hopefully.
Besides the skyline setup is only about 100 quid and will be happier at that power level.
Turbo wise holsets would be a good choice, from somewhere like compressor racing, twin scroll manifold to suit and their fairly responsive and support high hp figures.
See I've heard standard crank will be on its limits at around 600, maybe it'll do more but I'd personally go for a billet one.
But in general, your looking at a lot of custom stuff and expensive bits. Hell clutch and gearbox will be around 3-4k alone....my build is working out nearer 10k by the time it's finished.
That thing is a fecking animal i want!Originally Posted by ANDY black s13
Mobne's made 705 whp on stock crank, 260 degree 8.8mm lift tomei pro cams,was on boost at 5k ish and some other parts were stock as well like diff and shafts at that power level,his more recent engine is 575>600 ish, Sure I read on here via zilvia a chap in japan found stock crank limit was 845 bhp
I wont post the vids but mobne's car at gatebil is cool to watch
The main issue you going to get at that power level is lagg from the little 1.8.
A twin scroll manifold is a must made from steam pipe and not stainless shite.
Other than what's already said I genuinely cannot stress the fact that you will need one of the best mappers available to keep the little time bomb in one piece.
Would it not be worth going for the stroker route? Ca20det or bigger if they do it?
1998 Nissan 200sx s14a , 2000 std 5 speed with nismo supercoppermix clutch bn6 Sapphire Blue
Mapping big power cars isn't that much different to mapping lower powered cars.
You've just (ha ha!) got to get two things right: get it to flow well and build it strong enough to not physically break.
sounds simple, whats your secret?
Far from it - it'd be difficult to get 600bhp from a CA. Possible, but difficult / expensive.
post the video please
1st find a stock block with the drilled cooling channels though inter-bore wall equal distance in from both bore walls. Use a stock block then bore to 0.5mm oversize. Anything more will give trouble as bore wall is too thin to the cooling channels for high cylinder pressure that that power requires.
Stock crank is forged. Billet cranks are weaker than forged so have to be made from expensive higher grade material to compensate.
Then you have to make a complex trade between engine life, rpm and torque, power. Power = torque x revs. Torque requires high cylinder pressure which kills engines, every power stroke hammers the big end, makes the cylinder wall bulge out and piston crown flex. Increase in rpm will give more power for same torque (BMEP). Increase in rpm requires lighter piston and rods or will result in higher crank loads at TDC on exhaust stroke and BDC = reciprocating mass x stroke x rpm² and shorter life. Basically keeping rpm x sqrt(reciprocating mass) = constant is neutral. Reciprocating mass is taken as piston + rings + pin + upper 2/3 of rod. Titanium has huge benefits in reducing reciprocating mass but at high cost. It also has handling issues. There is a story of someone writing on a $0.5m jet engine casing made from Ti and all the middles fell out of the letters while being carried on a forklift.
The "ND550" engine was run to 9000 rpm (600bhp?) but I don't know what rpm the peak power was.
The dyno plot for JezH's 458.9bhp stopped at 7000rpm. Torque had peaked but power was still rising.
As you don't already have a plan and have had to ask it will cost lots. You can still expect it will break a few times, with nothing much salvageable. At this sort of power level it's not any tuner or mechanics fault, it's your demand for power. Jez was quite lucky in not having big blow ups (or didn't tell all). ND = Richie = Bigtone. ND had a big one before building the ND550. Can't remember if Richie had another. Bigtone had one (or 2, 3?) the ND block cracked at rear stud on no4? Mobne has had at least one. Mazworks must have had lots with the SR.
When it was for sale (199?) ND claimed the ND550 stood him at something like £50,000 or £55,000 but it was never clear if that was just the car as it was or all the broken / discarded bits in the workshop as well.
Jez's time attack car was around £30,000 - £35,000.
Still a 500bhp 1200Kg car is like a 625bhp 1500Kg car, 600bhp 1200Kg car is like a 750bhp 1500Kg car and how much will one of those cost? And how long will it last if used hard?
For that level of power it's not really economically viable to go with the CA, you just need to change too much and there's still an element of guess work on which part will fail next.
You're tuning an engine that only came with 169BHP in stock form, which in turn is based on an engine designed to toddle to the shops and back.
Why not a crate V8 motor from the states or something?
Wow, I'm glad so many people chimed in with very good input
I know it's going to be tough to get good driveability with big turbo, but I'd like to try. I've almost finished fabrication manifold for huge Holset variable geometry, I hope it will help. If not, compound charging will be next
I was interested in learning CA18 weak points, like rods bending at 4xx HP and head bolts stretching at big boost. But will I have to do any "magic" like filling the block, or changing bearing clearances to run some 10W-60 oil?
Yes, 4th runner bothers me a lot indeed... But I'm not sure I want to spend 800+ USD on intake manifold...
For now I hope main mechanical weaknesses will be in drivetrain and not in the engine itself.
As to why I am doing this - I don't know, probably just simpathy to good old CA18 which I enjoyed for 11 years already
We are not legally allowed to put another engine in the car, best I can do is KA24, and I wasn't sure 33% more displacement was worth the hassle.
So now I either will go on abusing my little CA18 and pushing it to the limits, or just sell it and that's all. Because I cannot think of another car with potential of Porsche 911/Corvette cheaper than Porsche 911/Corvette.
P.S. I also have another toy, Pontiac Firebird 6.0 Turbo, but it drinks 2.5X more gas and I don't even want to think about putting it out in the snow and salt...
P.S. I also think about automatic box, it could improve driveability of small engine/large turbo A LOT in my opinion
Could you put an SR22VET in there ?
Surely that would be the simple way to up the power on a drag S13.
http://news.topmotors.com/2011/07/ma...600hp%EF%BB%BF
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