WOT No EU Referendum Thread?

[Asht_200]

Agreed, civil servants are the real power at the moment but it would seem we are in the process of a regime change, to be honest I think DC is just the public facing head, the establishment do not like to go against the people this was verified to me when the Lords backed down, I suppose the illusion of democracy must be maintained.
According to Wikipedia DC went to Russia for three years after finishing at Oxford.
It will be interesting to see how the new government develops.

I’m not so sure. The people loved Diana and Harry. One has been kicked out and the other killed

I’m not so sure the new government is going to work so well. I think BJ will have to do a reshuffle. Priti Patel is useless. (She is in my next door constituency) but I’m kinda relaxed about Brexit now. 1 there is nothing we can do about it, 2 companies also seem more relaxed about it - the uncertainty did hurt me, but there is less uncertainty now


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[piman2k]

Senior advisor Tim Leunig quoted as saying the U.K. doesn’t need an agricultural sector.

Or fishing sector.

Go figure that one out.

U.K. government quick to distance themselves from it, but if a Brexit has taught us anything it’s that where there’s smoke there’s fire.

[piman2k]

Oh, and my personal favourite of the week, that Michael Gove (and I should imagine soon the rest of the Government) have started parroting that if we don't get a 'Canada Style' deal, which the EU have already laid out won't be acceptable to them, then we will go and get an 'Australian style deal'.

Which is obviously designed to appeal to the unintelligent and those persuaded by slogans because as most of us know, there's no TA in place between Australia and the EU.

[LeonatLarge]

Oh, and my personal favourite of the week, that Michael Gove (and I should imagine soon the rest of the Government) have started parroting that if we don't get a 'Canada Style' deal, which the EU have already laid out won't be acceptable to them, then we will go and get an 'Australian style deal'.

Which is obviously designed to appeal to the unintelligent and those persuaded by slogans because as most of us know, there's no TA in place between Australia and the EU.

I can't see us having a trade agreement with the EU it doesn't look like our government want one, the countries of the EU are already arguing about the huge hole the UK has left in their budget, if we leave on WTO they will have an even bigger hole to fill, as we will not be paying the fifty billion divorce bill, European fishermen will be bankrupt a few months into 2021 and Germany will be billions of euros out of pocket at a time when they will have to pay billions more in to the EU project to keep it going which will not bode well with the German people.

https://amp-theguardian-com.cdn.ampp...exit-shortfall

[piman2k]

Which part of that is good?

And if you were right, then why does our government insist on dishonestly representing their intention?

[arry]

European fishermen will be bankrupt a few months into 2021 and Germany will be billions of euros out of pocket at a time when they will have to pay billions more in to the EU project to keep it going which will not bode well with the German people.

Pah; Project Fear.

[sx rider]

Fish? Who the hell still eats fish anyways? That’s rhetorical I know most brexit voters can’t resist a bit of Cod. Even though they are on the endangered species list. Unless you’re eating from stocked lakes etc you a robbing from nature, seas fishing needs to be banned imo.

I used to love a bit of tuna or salmon but fishing is bad for the environment so I gave up fish about 15 years ago.

[R3K1355]

if we leave on WTO they will have an even bigger hole to fill, as we will not be paying the fifty billion divorce bill,

Hasn't that number shrunk now as we've already paid some of it?

BBC Cover it here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/51110096

Less than £30bn currently and under £20bn by the end of the transition period. Not chump change, but around 60% less than you actually thought.

[piman2k]

Last night the UK's own analysis declared that, even if we get the imaginary Canada deal that we know we can't have, the US trade deal would see a £3.4 bn benefit to the UK economy after FIFTEEN YEARS.

Which is also interesting considering the governments own conservative forecast is that the economy will shrink by 4.9% of GDP under that very same imaginary and unachievable Canada deal. That's £137 bn by my maths (£2.74 tn GDP 2019).

Ignoring the fact that a US/UK deal seems highly unlikely because of incompatibilities with food, medical and animal welfare standards.

So to summarise: Government itself predicts small benefit in many years from US trade deal despite not being likely to get it, designed to offset massive and immediate loss from leaving EU, all based around deal they have been told they can never have.

Novel.

[LeonatLarge]

Which part of that is good?

And if you were right, then why does our government insist on dishonestly representing their intention?

I don't think our government are dishonestly representing our intention, they are just trying to get the best deal for us, if we agree to the EU's terms it will not be a good deal.

[LeonatLarge]

Hasn't that number shrunk now as we've already paid some of it?

BBC Cover it here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/51110096

Less than £30bn currently and under £20bn by the end of the transition period. Not chump change, but around 60% less than you actually thought.

At £25bn the EU will still have to find £100bn if we leave on WTO which will be very difficult, as most nations in the EU will not be prepared to pay tens of billions of pounds in every year like we do.

I can't see the EU project lasting much longer as they no longer have the funds as the other nations have refused to fill the gap left by the UK.

[piman2k]

I don't think our government are dishonestly representing our intention, they are just trying to get the best deal for us, if we agree to the EU's terms it will not be a good deal.

It has nothing to do with the EU this point.

The Government are day-in day-out stating that if we don't get a 'Canada style' deal then we will go for an 'Australia style' deal.

Australia does not have a deal with the EU.

That's dishonest.

[Asht_200]

Fish? Who the hell still eats fish anyways? That’s rhetorical I know most brexit voters can’t resist a bit of Cod. Even though they are on the endangered species list. Unless you’re eating from stocked lakes etc you a robbing from nature, seas fishing needs to be banned imo.

I used to love a bit of tuna or salmon but fishing is bad for the environment so I gave up fish about 15 years ago.

I’m not sure. If we leave on WTO terms, then what reason would the UK have to allow EU fisherman to fish UK waters? Fish stocks may replenish


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[LeonatLarge]

It has nothing to do with the EU this point.

The Government are day-in day-out stating that if we don't get a 'Canada style' deal then we will go for an 'Australia style' deal.

Australia does not have a deal with the EU.

That's dishonest.

Agreed, an Australia style deal will be WTO, I don't think the government are being dishonest they are just telling the EU to **** off in a nice way, which is all part of the negotiations.

[LeonatLarge]

I’m not sure. If we leave on WTO terms, then what reason would the UK have to allow EU fisherman to fish UK waters? Fish stocks may replenish


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WTO will be better for the environment, don't tell XR they will stop the negotiations.

[R3K1355]

I’m not sure. If we leave on WTO terms, then what reason would the UK have to allow EU fisherman to fish UK waters? Fish stocks may replenish

Fish stocks are decent anyway, that was the whole point of the quota system.
We might well end up with too many, I doubt the British fleet has the capacity to cover what won't be taken by EU boats. Especially when tariffs come into play and no-one is buying it.

Not sure if that would be an issue or nature would just sort itself out.

[piman2k]

You're right, it doesn't have that capacity. The British fishing fleet as it stands doesn't catch it's full quota of fish from UK waters. Which has always been my gripe. There can't be so many 'destroyed' fishing communities if there are already more fish available than are being caught. Yes, geography doesn't always line up and some areas are disproportionately affected, but there is still more than they currently land.

The UK also fishes about a fifth of its catch from the CFP areas of the EU and affiliates.

[sx rider]

I suppose there is money to be made from robbing nature so those involved don’t want to give it up, just like the oil and gas industries. Every knows it’s no good but it carries on for profit.

Fish is loaded with heavy metals and micro plastics anyways, eat at your peril

Edit - because all those folks at the chippy are so well versed on how to pick their cod


Cod, Atlantic Cod
Gadus morhua

There are a many different Atlantic cod populations and whilst some are being well managed and are in a healthy state, many others are in a poor state, particularly around the UK. Many of the well managed fisheries are certified as sustainable by the Marine Stewardship Council (MSC) which can be identified in shops and on menus by a blue ecolabel with a white tick. Avoid eating cod from stocks which are depleted and where fishing is at unsustainable levels.

Ref
https://www.mcsuk.org/goodfishguide/...=1&perPage=200

[sideways14a]

I hate fish, any seafood makes me balk..
Cant eat it at all.

[Asht_200]

I prefer haddock


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