Building/planning/boundary law advice.

[-ghost-]

I thought someone would know the answer or have a good idea.


My moms neighbor has taken down her(on the deeds that we own that fence) 6ft fence and most of the path down the side of her house. They also have smashed a 3-4 inch drain pipe out "as it was in the way" and knocked out 2 gate posts. They have replaced the fence with a tiny 3.5 - 4ft fence so now they can see into my moms house and vice versa. She spoke to them about it they said its there fence and thats the way its staying.

They also have 4 big german shepherds who have attacked my moms dogs in the past so I can't see its safe to have a 4ft fence.

I was planning on putting up a 6+ foot fence and re concrete the path but my mom thinks the neighbor should put everything right?

So whats the best way to go about it?

[Dave270r]

Phone the council.

[karlf]

Normally dog shit on the door handles get a mention, so here it is

[Jonny Wilkinson]

I'd say it was worth asking them why they think it is their fence. If they say it says in their deeds, ask them to show you as it says they are yours on your deeds.

If it is your fence, they are liable to put it right or you can put it right and send them the bill but getting the money may then require going through the small claims court. I'd want to make absolutely sure it was my fence before spending any money though.

[corfublue]

I am pretty sure that the boundary which belongs to a property can be determined by, if you stand to the rear of your property with your back to the building, then the boundary to the left is your responsibilty and at the front the boundary to the right is your responsibilty. Maybe totally wrong but the deeds will tell you for sure

[skyshack]

Boarded fences the posts and rails are on the owners side.

Slide in panels are far harder to work out who owns.

[MEL]

The only way to tell is from looking through the deeds paperwork

[-ghost-]

I have the deeds in my hand its 100% my moms fence according to these deeds :S

[Prior]

Ohhh your entering a mine field here and it wont surprise you that Ive had to mediate on a few of these shitehawk cases,

Your first port of call should be the deeds and determine exactly where the land boundary lies. historically those who erect fences and walls will do it safely on their land, preferring to 'give' an inch or two to avoid problems later on with boundary disputes. If the fencing and posts are safely on your land then they have committed criminal damage. The police wont thank you for reporting it as they are a PITA to deal with, but its no different to entering somebodies garden and smashing something up. Afterall if there isnt an offence there then anybody could demolish their hated neighbours expensive nice new fence and put in some chicken wire with no comeback- cant see it myself.

Sometimes deeds will show a land boundary with a 'T' coming off the line in the direction of one of the houses. That house has responsibility for the fence. If there is nothing like that on the deeds then its classed as a party fence and the old rule about you take ownership of the fence to the right hand side. But thats usually in reference to who foots a repair bill etc.

If the fence is sitting directly on the boundary, which is unlikely, I would not bother any further arguing and erect the tallest fence I could right next to their 4ft one and take it on the chin. It'l cost you money, but by the same token their fence would have just become a complete waste of money and since your new fence is firmly on your land there's nothing they can do about it.

[Jonny Wilkinson]

If the fence is sitting directly on the boundary, which is unlikely, I would not bother any further arguing and erect the tallest fence I could right next to their 4ft one and take it on the chin. It'l cost you money, but by the same token their fence would have just become a complete waste of money and since your new fence is firmly on your land there's nothing they can do about it.

If the old fence was decrepit then I would do this.

If it was a good fence that did not require any kind of maintenance, I'd go after them for the criminal damage TBH. Just don't expect the Police to be keen.

[Marcos]

If you can I'd put up another 6ft fence on your side, they can't do anything about it, job done. Prior, is this your area of work?

[Jonny Wilkinson]

If you can I'd put up another 6ft fence on your side, they can't do anything about it, job done. Prior, is this your area of work?

Prior is one of the boys in blue.

[Prior]

If you can I'd put up another 6ft fence on your side, they can't do anything about it, job done. Prior, is this your area of work?

Not specifically as land and fence disputes are a civil matter and we as the police can only deal with criminal offences. However we get drawn into it when the neighbours declare war on each other and somebody ends up with a shovel wrapped around their swede.

As Jonny has said, tally up how much you stand to lose overall, i.e loss of old fence + cost of new, and work out a strategy there. By what you've described already they sound like right clients and this sort of stuff rarely gets sorted out easily & cheaply. Even if they were convicted of a criminal damage its unlikely they would be forced to replace the original fence.

[-ghost-]

Prior - Yeah We have the T on that fence and the fence at the back of the garden on the deeds. I will have to measure it all out tomorrow. I was trying to avoid the boys in blue they have better things to do and I have read this would be recorded and can affect selling the house?


There was nothing wrong with the fence or gate most of it was only a few years old.

My moms really really angry not just becuase its going to be £250 to sort out but the fact that they didn't even ask if they could take the fence down or smash half of her path down and leave it like that. We also noticed its filling the whole path with water when it rains its never done that before i think its fair to stay they have ****ed the lot up.


I"ll take some photos might make it easier to understand.


Reallied tempted to build a 3.5m garage on there side of the fence would rock to have a 2 post ramp

[Prior]

Prior - Yeah We have the T on that fence and the fence at the back of the garden on the deeds. I will have to measure it all out tomorrow. I was trying to avoid the boys in blue they have better things to do and I have read this would be recorded and can affect selling the house?

Its recorded but the only place potential buyers can see it would be on the crime map system. However that only shows it as a criminal damage with no further details so there could be 101 reasons for it rather than a neighbour dispute.

Never be afraid to call the police out, after-all you pay your rates like everyone else. the main problem comes in what we can realistically do, its a 50/50 chance whether we help or inflame the situation.

[Tricky-Ricky]

Total bloody minefield, i looked into this a bit when we bought our house, our deeds say we are responsible for all the boundary fences, and i suspect the left side fence bit only applies if stated so.

If i understand your description correctly it sound like not only have they removed the existing fence, they have taken up a pathway that you own and damaged a piece of you drainage on your property, if so a solicitor is the next option,, but it will get expensive if they have the rights to the fence on their deeds, if they haven't you should be able to take them to court to rectify the damage, but again its likely to cost you more than the price of erecting a high fence on your side, if its between gardens i think there is no hight restrictions, its only next to a highway that has hight restrictions,

So bung a 8 foot job up, build a small wall against/under it to stop the drainage water that is also coming your way, with a bit of luck it will flood the buggers out

Oh and if the dogs bark all the time you can report that as well and they will have to do something about it, good luck.

[Alex B]

I'm a landscape gardener type and what Skyshack said is 'technically' correct, but every fence we've put up has been the opposite, as Prior said, put the posts in so that they are up against the boundary line, therefore on the customers land, so we put the nice side for their benefit.

Also, when we looked into it, you have to errect a fence to keep dogs out, not in, so on that count it's your mums responsibility to fence them out, the fact they are aggressive may go in your favour, (though the fact that may lead to the dogs being PTS I would avoid that argument).

From your description I would definately get the police involved, for a variety of reasons, not least the neighbours sound like scum!

You can only put up a 'barrier' of 6' on any boundary line, be that a fence, wall or tree. If it's against a highway it's 3', but come into your land a metre and you can go as high as you like I believe.

Alex B

[roscopervis]

Total bloody minefield, i looked into this a bit when we bought our house, our deeds say we are responsible for all the boundary fences, and i suspect the left side fence bit only applies if stated so.

If i understand your description correctly it sound like not only have they removed the existing fence, they have taken up a pathway that you own and damaged a piece of you drainage on your property, if so a solicitor is the next option,, but it will get expensive if they have the rights to the fence on their deeds, if they haven't you should be able to take them to court to rectify the damage, but again its likely to cost you more than the price of erecting a high fence on your side, if its between gardens i think there is no hight restrictions, its only next to a highway that has hight restrictions,

So bung a 8 foot job up, build a small wall against/under it to stop the drainage water that is also coming your way, with a bit of luck it will flood the buggers out

Oh and if the dogs bark all the time you can report that as well and they will have to do something about it, good luck.

Not quite correct in terms of height - maximum a fence could be without planning permission is 2 metres (6ft 6).

This is a party wall boundary issue which is a solicitors dream and the wronged houseowners nightmare unfortunately. Look up the Party Wall Act etc 1996 for advice regarding the legal requirements for works to a party boundary.

[-ghost-]

Right time for some pics

We can chat via the window


The fence used to be as high/higher than the red dot. You can also see how they have left it!