has anybody come across these before?...

[sil80shwa]

hi guys, still on the lookout for a good source for a decent fitting tubular manifold for the CA (preferably without having to lose the ABS, but if it really comes to it, i may do in the end)

found these on the bay (i know, i know, ebay is full of swindlers and thieves peddling inferior goods etc etc..) and wondered if anyone has ever dealt with this seller/ has any knowledge of their quality?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Silvia-S13-CA1...item335b356581

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Silvia-S13-180...item4a9f8bf701

seller is france-rc and manifolds are branded as autobahn88.

anyone know any other good sources of good quality tubular manifolds, besides the for sale section..

am i justified in thinking that whatever i get, im to expect it to crack at some point, as this seems to be a continuing topic of conversation? why exactly do they crack anyway, is it just poor welding or fatigue from having a whopping heavy turbo swinging off it? if its the second, wouldn't some kind of fabricated support bracket for the tubby prevent cracking?

look forward to seeing your input guys and girls.

[martinbattye]

if its cheap... its cheerful.

[DeJi]

I don't know about that exact manifold, but I have an XS power one with a GT2871R, and it cracked after maybe a thousand kilometers. Had it re-welded by a pro and made a simple brace from one of the bolt holes to two unused threaded holes on the turbo flange (not hugely effective, could have done a sturdier one by bracing down to the engine/gearbox bolts) and it's been fine for 2 years and several thousand km's now.

[Sheepie]

right i have had a bad time with cheap manifolds not fitting cutting shaping etc
To be honest if u have got the time to arse about and dont mind cut fingers trying to
get on a nut on a stud thats to long etc then go ahead cheap and cheerful but u will need other parts too remember like braided lines etc and better gaskets etc

[sil80shwa]

These are the autobahn88 manifolds.
just a bit of a reference exercise (and cause i clearly have nothing better to do! )
i searched ebay for more manifolds quickly and came up with the xspower, 800bhp and uk performance manifolds too..







these 3 are the xs-power manifold, listed as clearing abs and cam cover.



these are from a seller called uk-performance-uk, who i emailed to ask if it clears abs/ cam cover and he said:-

"Hi,
To be honest I am unsure as we haven't fitted one of these manifolds ourselves and I wouldn't want to give you bad information.

Sorry that we couldn't help more...

Kind regards John at DemonMotorsport Ltd."

which i thought is fair enough, as he could have just said "yes, of course it will fit you bufoon!!"





these 4 are the 800bhp short runner manifold.


if you look at the xs-power manifold as a reference against the abs unit, it looks to me that where no.3 runner has been set away from no.4 to clear the abs unit, the autobahn88 no.3 runner is slap-bang where the abs unit sits. so this wold be no good for me.

similarly, the uk-performance manifold looks to have been designed the same as the xs-power one (it may even BE one, looking at it coupled with him saying that they hadn't fitted one, which would lead me to think that they dont actually manufacture them) but with added bracing.

and the 800bhp one, i can't make my mind up looking at it, so i think i'll email and ask.

with the short runner one, what would be the advantage of this style over the other 3? i appreciate that there is a shorter track for the exhaust pulses to travel down, but isn't the design of the others such that all 4 runners are near enough the same length, looking at the 800bhp one, the runners are different lengths, what would be the thinking behind that?

[ks13]

I would be looking at that unequal length 800bhp manifold, before any of the others posted.

It mimics the factory manifold, that is why. You should contact the seller and ask him if runners 1n4 and 2n3 are paired/divided, if they are and the price is right buy it.

[redsx94!]

Agreed with above as the equal length ones have been proving to cause pulses back to the valves cause flow issues. But the the unequal length it is designed so the air will come out in the right order as tomie make them exactly the same and there more reputated than xs power.

[MrPARR]

Someone once suggested that they crack from the tension when they're welded, and that once they crack and are rewelded properly are far less likely to crack again.

Iv had a xs manifold on mine for ages and its never cracked.

[arry]

Iv had a xs manifold on mine for ages and its never cracked.

You're not trying hard enough

[R3K1355]

For all the hassle involved the first question you wanna ask yourself is 'Do I really need one'????

If your goal is power over 300BHP then maybe yea, but if not it's alot easyer to stick with the sstd manifold and save yourself some money and trouble.

oh and 800BHP is a trader on here, so I'd look to their manifold first.

[sil80shwa]

hi RK, hows that super bargain exhaust working out for you?
yeah he's emailed back and said as sxoc member, theres 10% off (woop!)
if im honest, i want one primarily for the trick factor, but i do intend going for over 300 at some point too.

ive asked him what their reasoning is behind the unequal lengths is, just waitin on a reply.
im just a bit baffled, as i thought the majority of aftermarket manifolds were equal length? anybody got any further input on the merits/ disadvantages of either type please.

[arry]

Merits: It's easier to make
Disadvantages: It's not as efficient

As Mr Battye says - cheap and cheerful

[shogun]

In short (and now I will get lots of nag nag about this opinion) LOL

Less tubing, less resistance. Make use of the High power pulses straight out from head if you have a turbo that can take it.

Equal length tubing give more on a N/A.

Combine them both FTW.

Shortest possible tubing of equal length and as little bends as possible = Fast spool and very high power output.

I wouldn't mind that shorty one flipped upside down and with split exit. Then adding two wg tubes (1+4 and 2+3). Hmmm...sounds like the one I'm making

[docwra]

Iv had a xs manifold on mine for ages and its never cracked.

So have I and amazingly its for sale atm .........

[sil80shwa]

can anyone tell me what diameter the runners are in the standard CA manifold? the 800bhp ones are advertised as 42mm.

ive had a look at that tomei one ( "sploink!!" what a gorgeous piece of fabrication that is!!) they use 42.7mm diameter tube thats 2mm thick, HKS use 3mm thick tube, again 42.7mm (is the extra .7 cause its on the SR, not the CA...)
also, tomei make the short runner style with the split/ partition which none of these ebay ones seem to.

[R3K1355]

Hey dude, yep the mongoose is goin on soon, have taken a little time to give it a polish

Could the difference in diameter be down to larger exhaust ports on the SR??

[Jonny Wilkinson]

The 800 bhp one looks like it is mandrel bent not welded sections. An equal length one is going to be very difficult to mandrel bend because of the shape, I would have thought.

It would take a lot more welding to make an equal-length than if you have mandrel bent with just the flanges welded on.

Could that be the reason or part of it ?

[sil80shwa]

This is the blurb on the Tomei website about the manifold:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our EXPREME exhaust manifold is now available for SR20 owners who want a performance upgraded from the genuine exhaust manifold. With our product you can retain the genuine setup and no special modifications are needed to fit the standard turbo.

With the SR20DET the exhaust manifold was designed to be close from the exhaust port to the turbine. With the comparison test of our isometric prototype & the factory genuine manifold which also utilizes the same layout, it shows that ours has succeeded in delivering an overall improved performance in both torque and power increase in areas like in the higher RPM range in which you were not able to utilize before. With our extensive testing we have reached the conclusion that the normal design is superior as a total overall efficiency. So to develop an exhaust manifold similar with the design and setup as the factory manifold we were finally able to produce a product worthy to bear our name as a product that has the potential to deliver an overall increase in performance.
　
1. Acquiring preeminent turbine response
Acquiring the preeminent turbine response, by utilizing a short piping layout.

2. Excessive anti-pressure rise is prevented even at high RPMs. Ideal exhaust efficiency is obtained.
TOMEI EXPREMEs exhaust manifold for the SR20 is designed with a partition plate inside the 1st & 4th turbine side ports as the 2nd & 3rd are divided for the exhaust ports. The sequential ignition firing order of the SR20 (1-3-4-2) can cause exhaust interference. The exhaust is discharged from both left and right of the partition plate and can cause to happen where the pipes all merge together. Now TOMEI has found the best possible exhaust flow.
　


reading the Tomei blurb, i can buy into the idea of short runners used to speed up the response time of the turbo (compared to the other manifolds using longer runners, this makes complete sense) i.e. like the standard manifold does!

i get the idea of using a divider to stop backflow into other cylinders too (am i right in thinking the CA also fires 1-3-4-2?)

what is it with the standard manifold that makes it restrictive over 300hp, is it literally the diameter of the tubing not being great enough or the shape of the manifold as a whole or a combination, so it isn't physically able to flow enough exhaust gases out of the cylinders

does the standard manifold have a divider or not (i can't remember from taking the engine apart last time)

so do we think that if the 800bhp one had a divider in it would be the best one to go for?
im just wondering wether you could somehow add a divider in, either welding a piece in or having a spacer plate made up to sit between the manifold and turbo, use a gasket either side and either weld a divider into the plate or have it machined up somehow

im thinking this as it looks like the 800bhp mani has the tubes coming at the turbo flange in the same way as the tomei one does, so just needs a divider to make it bob-on..

[martinbattye]

now thats more like it....

look at the price also

[alanjuggler]

.. and they still crack

though interesting that tomei suggest using heatwrap - doesn't quite match up with the spiel that the ceramic coaters talk about wrap damaging the mani.

by the way, for info, i'm using an old XSP style mani - one bren brought in ages ago in error from memory, correcting elbow picked up from one of the old XSP dealers..

it's cracked on only one tube off number 2 - wasn't blowing, only v. slight blackening around the crack and also cracked ironically on one of the small braces.

MIG'd with stainless wire and it's been fine since - at the moment i'm using my car every day so a far amount of heating/cooling cycles are going on.