Ay Ideas? [Archive] - SXOC Bulletin Board

bond_200

05-07-2001, 17:13

Alright people,

Had my mongoose system fitted yesterday, love sound killed a couple of flat spots, etc etc........ but when the car is idling, it just unleashes about 12 tons of smoke all over the car behind at traffic lights, or the poor pedestrian on the street. Simon Norris said it is normal and it happens on some cars 'cos all back pressure is flowing straight out (or something). He fitted a breather sytem to my car but it still hasnt cleared it. Has anyone else had this problem after fitting new system? or is it just my bad luck and my turbo has died or my engine is falling to pieces etc. I can't believe its my turbo as I had a good used one fitted about 3 months ago. Any ideas appreciated.
Thanks

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Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose
Tons of smoke

Paul_S13

05-07-2001, 18:19

What colour is the smoke

------------------
Black S13
235Bhp @ 5600rpm
Saab intercooler
Big ass HKS 'zorst
http://www.contrabandent.com/pez/otn/puke/repuke.gif

bond_200

05-07-2001, 18:21

its white.
I believe if it is the turbo, it would be a bluey colour, or am I mistaken?

------------------
Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose
Tons of smoke

Ripper

05-07-2001, 18:36

Head gasket?

------------------
Ripper

Grey '93 S13 Auto
Mods: Uprated smelly tree
Tree uprated at Ripper Laboratories, Florida.

Funb0b

05-07-2001, 18:41

Ditto

Oil & Water mixing= white smoke and some times sweet sickly smell.

------------------
Barry S13 89

T28,FMIC,LSD,RLATC/LC/FTS,Wilwood 4 pots,Nismo Quick Shift,Blitz Nur Spec R,Blitz Dual TT,Apexi SuperAVR-R.

Coming Soon: JE low compression forged pistons,L/B polihed conrods, knife edged crank, L/W crank pulley, 550cc injectors, P&P head, Cams & Cam gear's, custom map & fingers crossed.

Chimp

05-07-2001, 22:43

bond..

The EXACT same thing happened to mine about 2 hours after fitting the mongoose, its a funny old world. I know exactly what you mean though, coz apart from the smoke I bet it runs sweet.. Its weird, and its totally beyond my expertise. If you find out what the relation to new exhaust/smoke is, I would love to know.. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif

It stopped me from driving mine, my bottom end was rattly but i could live with it, but i aint havin that horrendous embarrasing thing that happens at traffic lights happen to me, ever ever ever again. Hence, new engine..

Funb0b

06-07-2001, 00:21

Originally posted by Chimp:
bond..

The EXACT same thing happened to mine about 2 hours after fitting the mongoose, its a funny old world. I know exactly what you mean though, coz apart from the smoke I bet it runs sweet.. Its weird, and its totally beyond my expertise. If you find out what the relation to new exhaust/smoke is, I would love to know.. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif

It stopped me from driving mine, my bottom end was rattly but i could live with it, but i aint havin that horrendous embarrasing thing that happens at traffic lights happen to me, ever ever ever again. Hence, new engine..

Wot happened at the light's do tell.

Chimp

06-07-2001, 08:42

NEVER

they laughed at me man, the people.. they laughed.. it was smokey, when it cleared i saw them laugh. I hate this story, it makes me feel sick.

Jezz_S13

06-07-2001, 09:32

Think I'll skip the mongoose.

------------------
Please take nothing I say literally; even I don't believe it.

Chimp

06-07-2001, 09:38

hehe, im sure its a coincedence or the exhaust back pressure finding a weak spot somewhere.. If I hadnt chopped my old system up to cunningly fit in the bin. Id have swapped them back just out of curiousity..

Jezz_S13

06-07-2001, 09:48

A recurring coincidence?

I'm just jealous really, I got a cat http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif.( and a couple of dogs http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/wink.gif)

My engine at present would physically get itself out of the engine bay and put itself in the bin is I put a mongoose on it.

Please offer lots of assistance in my new thread 'Engine rebuild, what bit do I need'

Cheers,
Jezz.

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Please take nothing I say literally; even I don't believe it.

Clong

06-07-2001, 10:39

Gotta say gent's, when i put my 'goose on, i had no smoke at all, not even a bit. Smelt a bit funny at first, probably due to all the glue/stickers burning off it. 'Spose it's a case of you pay's your money, takes your bets. The sound and power gain has got to be worth a bit of smoke though?

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1990 Blue S13
Mongoose 'zorst
K&N, ND Boost upgrade.

http://www.ihs4ever.com/~cwm/otn/violent/itschy.gif

Chimp

06-07-2001, 11:28

I just dunno how to explain it. Id love to show you a "bit" of smoke though http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif

Clong

06-07-2001, 11:51

I take it is more than a bit then?

------------------
1990 Blue S13
Mongoose 'zorst
K&N, ND Boost upgrade.

http://www.ihs4ever.com/~cwm/otn/violent/itschy.gif

Chimp

06-07-2001, 12:47

yep, its a total pain in the arse, oil must be getting into somewhere. Thing is I dont know if its related to the exhaust at all. And since I have changed a turbo when it started smoking, i reckon its coincidence. But yer, we're talking Hiroshima here, not little red indian style smoke signals http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif

If i can be arsed I will check the plugs, infact I will, tonight.

Clong

06-07-2001, 13:00

Hmmm...without teaching your grandmother to suck egg here, but i assume you have checked your head gasket (since your car is in bits this should be easy, no?). I don't understand how fitting a free flow exhaust should make the car smoke, unless some of the breathers are seriuosly plugged with crap.

------------------
1990 Blue S13
Mongoose 'zorst
K&N, ND Boost upgrade.

http://www.ihs4ever.com/~cwm/otn/violent/itschy.gif

Chimp

06-07-2001, 13:10

like I said, its confusing.. and surely a coincidence.. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif

The head gasket might have gone, hard to tell, no oil in the water, no emulsion in the filler cap.

and I have 2 engines, a new one in bits (to be rebuilt regardless so i can be 100% certain its fine) and one in the car, a smoker. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif

Chimp

06-07-2001, 14:21

it plays on yer mind. Im gonna take my 200 out tonight and nail it. The mind plays tricks.. what if my new turbo is broken, i just dont know what to make of it, All i do know is Im calling it a day if i put the new lump in and it smokes.

olly200sx

06-07-2001, 15:45

White smoke eh, that would be steam then, caused by water entering the chamber, usually through a split head gasket, you must be loosing water and you could also check the oil to see if it is milky, because oil and water don't mix very well the oil becomes sludgy and white like salad cream. Give it a try.

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S13 - Lots of Mods

Ripper

06-07-2001, 16:02

Mayonnaise.

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Ripper

Grey '93 S13 Auto
Mods: Uprated smelly tree
Tree uprated at Ripper Laboratories, Florida.

Paul_Ralph

07-07-2001, 00:11

Have you checked your spark plugs yet. My smoking problem showed clearly on the plugs especially no.4 as this is the hottest running of the set...!!! I suffer from blow past oil... now running uprated turbo and head etc. All the extra goodies found the engine weakness... Knackered !!!

bond_200

07-07-2001, 11:13

I've driven my car round for miles now hoping that ND were right by saying that giving it 20-30 miles might clear it out since the breather system was fitted, but no. It still pours with smoke.Mine must be exactly the same as yours Chimp, cos I hav no oil in water, oil level is not dropping at all. I have not got a clue what to do. I'm having to drive my mums focus around cos the smoke is so embarassing - this is a bad situation.
Its times like this I hate owning this car.

------------------
Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose
Tons of smoke

dave_s13

07-07-2001, 11:53

Horse radish sauce
.
.
.
Fck it I'm off, I have to pay for this at home see ya monday.

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****in shut up woman, the car was supposed to slide like that...

Chimp

07-07-2001, 16:37

im still thinking, been out and had a look at it today and have dropped my crank off to be polished or have a regrind. But Im at a total loss really. It'll be another 3 weeks or so before the engines are swapped and then I'll be able to see what the problem was. Unless I have been unlucky with turbo's and both are shot. Depressing innit?

Ideally I should put my bust turbo back on the car, blank the oil feed to it. And drive it, this would totally eliminate the turbo end of it, and then it HAS to be either Rings/valve stem seals or some kind of weird head problem. Or it would confirm the turbo seals are gone coz there would be no smoke. Bit of hassle though.. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif

bond_200

07-07-2001, 16:52

Chimp,
I've just taken my car back to Halfords and complained, they said it was turbo, I said no cos I had it replaced two months ago and said some crap which made it look like I know what I'm talkin bout, then they suddenly changed their minds and said I was right, it isnt oil or water, it is paint in the xhaust and they are gonna phone Mongoose and attempt to order a new system in and will try that one on my car.

So fingers crossed eh?!

------------------
Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose
Tons of smoke

Spooky

07-07-2001, 17:13

Hope it all goes well bond, it just goes to show that they will try to bluff Joe Public into spending loads of dosh. "New turbo Mr. Bond, we can do you a good deal, £2000 fully fitted, no warranty, and if it smokes then it'll be you thingummybob whatsits, but we'll do you a good price."

------------------
Peter
Black 1992 200SX S13
Standard except for Blizt FATT type S turbo timer
175.5 BHP @ 6169 RPM
183.8 LBFT @ 4203 RPM

bond_200

07-07-2001, 17:28

True Spooky, true.

Good luck with your system mate. I'll let u know if they do eventually fit a good, working, non-smoking one.

Ed

------------------
Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose
Tons of smoke

Spooky

07-07-2001, 20:25

Hope so mate, let us know. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif

------------------
Peter
Black 1992 200SX S13
Standard except for Blizt FATT type S turbo timer
175.5 BHP @ 6169 RPM
183.8 LBFT @ 4203 RPM

Kristian

09-07-2001, 10:22

I must say it sounds like the turbo to me even though it is new. I had this problem once i'd fitted my HKS hiper Muffler. The reduced back pressure sucks the oil through the worn seals. However, if your turbos new i'd check the following. Is your oil level above Max? If it is then oil will be sucked through the oil seals even if theyre brand new as this is the weakest link. If the oil level is over full the return cant return easily to the over full sump and there is a pressure build up and hence oil is forced through the seals. Also if it has ever been over full, then you will have risked oil been forced into the intake system, where it could be residing in the Intercooler. oil being constantly blown through will cause this and remember it only takes a tiny drop to produce masses of smoke. I doubt its water being mixed with oil. Does the coolant level ever drop?? the paint in the exhaust also sounds a little unlikely to me. good luck

Originally posted by Spooky:
Hope so mate, let us know. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif

Chimp

09-07-2001, 11:27

I agree. Im not sure what paint would be doing in a SS/ Exhaust, another fine example of Halfords expertise.

Kristian

09-07-2001, 12:14

I think its almost definitely your turbo. I fitted my HKS Hiper Muffler and the same thing happened. The relief of the back pressure results in the oil being sucked through the turbo oil seals. I replaced the turbo and it was gone. Belowing Smoke at idle usually points to the turbo. If your coolant level remains fine then its your turbo. However, check the following: The oil level. If it is a bove MAX then the oil feed return from the turbo to the sump becomes pressurised because it cant get back into the sump easily. The increased pressure then results in the oil being forced through the oil seals and you get smoke. Also if you have ever over filled the oil it can get forced into the intake system and get lodged in the intercooler. Check pipes intercooler etc. Remember it only needs a tiny amount of oil to create lots of smoke. Personally, i'm sorry to say, it sounds like your turbo. Clouds of white smoke at idle generally mean this and also the quantitties you speak of are usually only associated with this. Anything else and you'd almost certainly be in more trouble than you seem to be. the constant smoke at idle points to permanent leakage of oil through the oil seals. Its the new low back pressure exhaust that has highlighted the problem.

Kristian

09-07-2001, 12:14

Chimp

09-07-2001, 12:24

I reckon you are right, i just cant see valve stems producing the probs we have. And anything more sinister in the engine would be apparent. I think turbo aswell.. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif I just pray that the new one i fitted is ok..

ok let me try the old jedi mind trick..

YOU WILL COMMUTE FROM MANCHESTER TO JUNCTION 18 M6 WHERE YOU WILL STOP AT MY HOUSE AND FIX THINGS.. http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/biggrin.gif

bond_200

09-07-2001, 16:06

http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/eek.gif
http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/mad.gif
http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif
Alright peeps.
Bad news for me, bad bad news. Jap engine here I come. £1800 fitted at Norris Designs.
My dipstick was lying to me and the car ahd too little oil in it to do everything it needed to do and turbo is slowly on its way out. As my big end is also dying I thought, feck it, new engine it is. Jap was cheapest and qucikest option so there we go. If it still smokes then I'm truly ****ed. Drop my car off on firday and get it back by the following friday.
I had to take out another loan on top of my original loan to pay for this. Hope to God that it is worth it.
Cheers for all your help http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif

------------------
Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose
Jap engine in a week

Spooky

09-07-2001, 21:32

http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif That's really bad news bond. Sorry to hear it. Why or how rather was your dipstick lying to you? The new engine should be a lot better, I believe that they have a 8,000 rev limit!

------------------
Peter
Black 1992 200SX S13
Standard except for Blizt FATT type S turbo timer
175.5 BHP @ 6169 RPM
183.8 LBFT @ 4203 RPM

Kristian

10-07-2001, 10:43

Sorry for excessive messaging!! the board seemed to go a bit wonky yesterday and i couldnt see any messages i'd posted, so wrote another and then couldnt see that one either. Anyway, they're all there now!!!! Hope the car is better soon. How was your dipstick lying to you???

Originally posted by Spooky:
http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/frown.gif That's really bad news bond. Sorry to hear it. Why or how rather was your dipstick lying to you? The new engine should be a lot better, I believe that they have a 8,000 rev limit!

bond_200

10-07-2001, 22:41

Technically it wasn't lying, but I had misjudged bits of oil on the "High" mark as meaning the oil was quite full, when in fact it was just ****ty bits of oil picked up whilst bringing it out. I am a fool basically!
http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/redface.gif

------------------
Red S13 (1991)
K&N + dump valve
Skyline Spoiler
Mongoose system
Jap engine in a week

Chimp

11-07-2001, 09:23

^^^^^

exactly the reason my bottom end went http://300zx.co.uk/200sx/ubb/smile.gif bummer innit!

Kristian

11-07-2001, 10:38

It is one of the worst dipsticks i've ever had to read! It seems to give a different reading on one side to the other. I always used to over fill it just to make sure, especially with doing track days but then I was getting smoke occasionally. thought turbo was on its way out again. however, after dropping some oil and cleaning the intake system shes now not smoking at all.