View Full Version : RX7 - whats the crack?
SpeedyPete
13-01-2003, 16:28
Im going to be buying an S13 but ive been recently tempted by a slightly older RX7.
Has anyone had one or first hand experience with them?
The guys on the RX7 board suggest it can be boosted to 600bhp, and over 270bhp just with a full exhaust and filter....
If I was to get a bigger turbo apparently you get mental power.
Sounds tasty, but what do you think? (please be as unbiased as possible - Im asking you lot cos your a good bunch ):)
Paul_S13
13-01-2003, 16:32
The rotary engine doesn't last much longer than 80k and when it needs a rebuild you better qualify for a mortgage because you will need one.
Also the rotary engine is supposed to be thirsty as hell.
What generation is it, if its the fd (most recent one) Then you are looking at a great trackday car (go kart for the road) lovely and light and the rotary engine has a lovely power delivery... And if i was under 6'3" i would be owning one right now :( Also they are less than fuel efficient but thats the realist side of me...:rolleyes:
Thought of getting one when I was looking at getting my S13. Like most people I was scared off by the rotory engine :(
If you know what you're doing, or have a local specialist, I've heard they are really good cars :)
Jibber knows plenty about these I think? :)
Will Taylor
13-01-2003, 16:38
Ask the RX7 lot how much they've spent on maintenance (not upgrades, just fixing faults) in the last year. I'm far from being an expert, but RX-7s are notoriously expensive to fix, cos no-one knows how to work on it's rotary engine.
The current one is very tasty though :D
SpeedyPete
13-01-2003, 16:40
They do admit to high costs of running...
...but what about the 200sx, its not all trouble free is it
What killed the car was the ****el engine, FSO(i think) used it their cars and they weren't very reliable, Mazda followed suit (or bought FSO) and the some of the reliablity issues were corrected. The biggest problem was wear of the rotor tips, which happened far to frequently for most people, resulting in a total strip down and rebuild, so the rotary engine never really took off. Shame, since the modern materials have cured the problem and they are very sweet engines. They rev to infininty (well not quite but you get the idea). Downside is they drink fuel, standard RX-7 is around 20 mpg i believe.
The owners club for these cars is very good and you can source the hard wearing tips from them.
Power-wise, yes large power is possible from these engines but it needs to well sorted to do it, good tuners for these cars are few and far between. Don't know exactly what they produce, it depends on the model i guess.
SpeedyPete
13-01-2003, 16:45
An SX would lose to one in a straight line then?
Will Taylor
13-01-2003, 16:54
Originally posted by PugPete
They do admit to high costs of running...
...but what about the 200sx, its not all trouble free is it
Err, no, but it's standard engine design, and there are plenty of them around for parts, so you can get bits for affordable prices, and get affordable people to attach them for you, if you are too much of a pussy to put them on yourself (like me) :p
Depends on model, in standard trim the last model is quicker (there isn't much around that is quicker TBH, they stonking cars) but you would not pick one up for S13 money...
The previous versions weren't partculary good cars from the reviews it got but i have not driven one so i can't comment. I doubt there would be much in it from a head to head, although i believe the SX is a bit quicker.
The first model, no. Again comparing standard models against each other.
sroberts
13-01-2003, 16:57
I read something that stated that they drink like hell, but in terms of build costs they are cheap incomparison to say a skyline because there are fewer parts. The whole engine is based around the seal? Race spec ones use 3mm seal, this could be had for less than 3 grand. Don't flame me, that was from memory :confused:
Si :)
One other problem I was told about by an RX-7 owner (at the last Box Hill meet) is getting a good one.
They're as rare as rocking horse sh*t over here as they are import only and the Japs love 'em so much over there that very few come across.
Apparently they get used as track day drift cars and get totally thrashed over there so if one finds it's way over here it's a good bet it's been ragged sensless.
And as already stated the ****el Rotary engines are quite thirsty beasts.
Alg;)
Martin T
13-01-2003, 17:59
Fook me they aint cheep - parkers mis-guide rekons that they go for about £6k average nick on an L plate!
The Twin Turbo ****el Rotary is the most powerful stock engine, HP to Liter wise in the world. The main seals blow quickly if you crank the HP above stock though. If you want one I would say buy it pull the engine and have it built for high Horses.
I would have to say that the FD is Probably the nicest looking car on the planet, looks kinda like a miniature Viper;)
sroberts
13-01-2003, 18:45
That would be the 2mm to 3mm seals conversion, which makes a race spec engine :confused: :confused: :confused:
Si :)
looked into this myself and from what i can gather they are very expensive to run it terms of economy and repair, ive herd that the average life of an average engine is around 60K (some more 80-100K and some a lot less)
performace and power delivery in the 3rd gen. models is supposed (i dont have first hand experience) to be something else, dont think a standard 200 has a chance to be honest, and they are highly tunable. Due to the simplicity of the engine there a few parts to consider and for those seeking high power levels its probably cheaper than tuning/building a conventional engine.
i know there are certain "reliability mods" that can be done to the engine which are pretty cheap and easy i think, also i think there where a few teething problems on the earlier cars (1993?) which are probably best avoided unless the history is good.
i think that if you dont mind getting your hands dirty and enjoy :rolleyes: regular maintainence stuff, as long as you get a good-un you wont have to much of a problem.
think i would be tempted to buy one with a freshly rebuilt engine (plenty advertised) or one which requires a re-build (£3000ish) and negotiate a good price.
uk models are available which will probably help in terms of insurance, you just have to look hard (diddnt sell well).
this is only stuff i have picked up on and may not be totally correct so feel free to correct me.
Rick.
>An SX would lose to one in a straight line then?
Not if the Mazda broke down
Mazda is more expensive, parts and routine repairs are more expensive, running costs are more and tuning parts more.
Mazda is quicker, but for that money, you could tune a S13 to hell and back.
the motors are reliable units, as long as it aint high milage (as said by 60k there fecked), the chrome peels off on the rotor housings and there aint anybody in this country who can replate and grind em back, so its new housings for a 700quid each or second hand ones, but with the later you run the risk of the plating not lasting long. the apex seals were the week point, it was nsu which discovered this with the r080. mazda improved the design somwhat, but there still the engines failing. you can get wider seels, but if your running high psi you dont want carbon ones as these are prone to cracking under the preasure. some people in australia have developed 2 and 3 piece apex seels of 3mm thickness, these are better for big power, the 2 piece being best for turbo applications. also race spec seels are available for the endplates. uprated staionary gears are advisable as is oil pumps as it uses the oil fed thru the rotors to help cool the engine. you can port the end plates to improve top end performance at the cost of low down power and smoothness. a bridgeport being the most popular, good gains at top without sacrificing to much at the bottom. wgt developments are the only ones in this country i really trust, had good dealings with them. hurley in coventry are quite good but a bit overated and rotechnics you should stay away from (imho) they still owe me a gasket set to this day:mad: . if you can afford a good one there great, but all in all your better of with conventional design, its easier to fix and parts more readily available....
Originally posted by A8-RICK
uk models are available which will probably help in terms of insurance, you just have to look hard (diddnt sell well).
I didn't think they did an offical import on the later ones.
Like this.....
Although they did sell a UK version of this one (earlier model don't know which though)
Alg;)
im pretty sure there are genuine uk cars, even the later 3rd Gen.
theres a nice standard looking silver one for £6200 on the autotrader site at the moment which claims to be a uk car.
love em but reliability / cost issues would always be im the back of my mind if i bought one, i think they would be hugely popular otherwise, and probly twice the price, its such a timeless design, still love the look of the 1st gen. cars.
There is one good thing about them.
I'm pretty sure thst they are rated as having a 650cc engine so cheap tax:D but they are thirsty and expensive in all other ways.
Theres an ABSOLUTELY GORGEOUS one in Autotrader at the moment but it's £10.5k!!! :eek:
Dave
Originally posted by AntS13
There is one good thing about them.
I'm pretty sure thst they are rated as having a 650cc engine so cheap tax but they are thirsty and expensive in all other ways.
Aren't the later RX-7's twin rotarys or something. I thought each rotary unit had about 650cc with a total of 1300cc
The new RX-8 is going to have a 1300cc single rotary.
A8-RICK,
You're probably right I'm no expert, but I didn't think there were offical imports.
SteveSadler
14-01-2003, 01:45
very good cars with good engines, when serviced correctly.
dont be frightened of all the hype. ive driven both the series 2 and later series. and a mate of mine has one with a std engine, just changed injectors and big T4 equivalent turbo (rated to 600+hp), FPR and a few other mods and he will push some eserious power even running moderate boost. The got nice interiors though no leg room at the back, but who cares!
they are very very very quick when modified and they handle brilliantly even in std form. very easy to modify and a full rebuild costs under 2K!
if you need more info on these cars then let me know (I almost bought a couple years back b4 I started on the modifying trail)
they just drink too much fuel, but nothin a POWER FC wont sort out
Originally posted by Algie
Although they did sell a UK version of this one (earlier model don't know which though)
Alg;) That's a 1st gen RX7.
They lived about 40k miles, and then exploded.
Interference motors. One thing breaks, everything breaks.
all variations were imported..
My mistake, not my speciallist subject.
Alg;)
dave_s13
14-01-2003, 09:11
I once got pi$$ed on by one in my old s13, its was great watching him rag the fook out of it.
Here's a cracking link on how a rotary engine works, clever stuff.
http://www.howstuffworks.com/rotary-engine.htm
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